Episode #20 - Blocking with Lucas VanBerkel

In this episode we are joined by another two-time Olympian. Lucas talks about his mental state after attending two olympics, the sacrifices his family had to make to help him succeed, and the role that fun has in long term success. He breaks down why he loves playing for the National Team more than playing overseas, how volleyball has changed over his 10 year professional career, and why blocking is such a difficult skill.

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Transcript

0:00

Hello, everyone, and welcome back to the Pit to Pro podcast. In this episode, we're joined by Lucas van Berkel. Lucas is a world class middle blocker and a two time Olympian. He recently retired after 10 years of professional volleyball and 14 years with the Canadian national team. Expect to learn how Lucas ended up with no contract the season before the Olympics, the strategic role of pulling hands while blocking, why Lucas doesn't like to commit block, and the struggles of returning to normal life after the Olympic Games. Before we get started, I'd like to introduce our newest partner on the Pit to Pro podcast. I'm sure I'm not the only one who wants to hit harder and score more points. That's why we've decided to partner up with the athlete wellness Academy to deliver you guys the best in arm swing training With their new Arm Swing Academy, you'll receive personalized video analysis and feedback, along with individualized workouts and on court drills. for joining us. Continuous technical support and a dedication to this process will have you hitting harder and playing pain free. AWA has worked extensively with the three of us at the Pit to Pro podcast, as well as the top university programs across the country. If that sounds like something you want to be a part of, sign up for the Arm Swing Academy using the link in our show notes or Instagram bio, and get 10 off every month of your subscription. The Arm Swing Academy offers a 7 day free trial, which you can cancel at any time, and if you're not seeing progress after one month of joining the Academy, you will be refunded. It's completely risk free, so click the link in our show notes or Instagram bio and start your 7 day free trial today. But now, ladies and gentlemen, please welcome Lucas van Berkel. Hello and welcome to the Pit the Pro podcast. Jesse, Matthias, and Aaron Elson. This podcast is meant to guide young athletes on their journey to high performance. Join us as we share our first hand experiences in an effort to help you reach your own valuable goals.

Jesse 1:45

And we're live. Let's go. Boom. Let's go. Lucas. Thanks for joining us. 2020, you didn't have a contract and you had to go back to the full time center with OOG actually. Yeah. So you don't have a contract. You're training with a 17 year old. What kind of doubts were running through your mind when you couldn't find a contract three quarters of the way through your career?

Lucas 2:13

Yeah. Oh, okay. That whole time frame was so crazy because It was January, 2020. We just, Qualified for the Olympics. Like we're on the biggest high, so crazy. Um, like, yeah, just going through all the feelings and then COVID hits and then postpones or first cancels the Olympics, then postpones, and then everything's a mess for that summer. Um, And then yeah, like teams aren't like hiring the same kind of foreigners as they would because they don't really know the situation. Um, so like long story short, like I didn't find a contract and that like sucked. It's just like a huge like hit to the ego. There were some things but like nothing that really grasped my attention or that I wanted to do. Um, like there's one I could have gone to Egypt, but like always in my mind, I'm like, Hey, if I go to Egypt, I'm preparing for like the biggest year of my life. Like I want to make this Olympic roster. I want to be training like super hard training with the best players. I'm like, if I go to Egypt right now, probably not the best quality of volleyball that I could find. Um, so I kind of held off on that. And I was like, Hey, I'm just going to wait it out, wait it out, see if something better comes, but nothing came. And then, um, yeah, everyone is going to the pro pro teams and I'm kind of stuck here. I'm just like, Oh my goodness. Like, this is the biggest year of my life. I don't have a team. Um, I'm just like, need to be competing somewhere. So, so yeah, I went to NDP for, um, yeah, I think it was like, I don't even know. It was a month or two months with Oog. Yeah, man. That was, Honestly, that was so nice just to, that's how we met pretty much. Oh, we met before, but that's. Well,

Mathias 3:53

that's how we became bros. Exactly. That's how we became bros. Just me driving you around all the time.

Lucas 3:57

Yeah, exactly. So like, it was, it's definitely like a shot to your ego. Um, and you're just like a lot of doubts in your mind. Like, okay, why can't I find anything? And then you're just like, well, I'm like not going to make this Olympic roster because I'm not playing anywhere. I'm kind of like messaging my agent, um, while still like going to training and like really trying to get better. Luckily, Dan Lewis was there, um, and he like really helped me. He like coached me and said, okay, like, this is like a sweet opportunity that we have that we can work with each other, work on specific things that like, we need you to get better for the national team. And it was kind of like a blessing in disguise because we just went to town and we did so many cool things. Um, and then yeah, so it was it was like definitely tough times, but it was sweet. And then the situation came up, um, for me to go to Germany, to Durin. Um, and I knew Lair was there, but actually I went for, like, pennies. Like I didn't go for any money and I was like, that doesn't matter right now. I just want like go to like a decent league play. Doesn't matter. I just want to get like prepared as much as possible before next summer and national team and, and the Olympics. And so luckily it all worked out, but there is, there were definitely some dark days during that time. Yeah. That's

Mathias 5:17

actually insane. I, I was trying to explain to some of the guys on my team, like, They were like, I was like, yeah, like we have a podcast with Lucas tonight. And, and I was like, how do you know? I was like, wow, we kind of hung out pretty much every day for.

Lucas 5:31

Yeah, we did actually. Two months. That's sweet. Honestly, that, that was huge too, because like you guys. I was obviously a lot older, but you guys just kind of brought me in and we like hung out a lot more than I thought. Like, I remember I went, well, at the time too, Holly was pregnant and so she didn't come out cause she was back in, where was she? She was in Calgary at the time. And so like, I got a pregnant wife, I'm in like NEP and Gatineau, like not necessarily the place I want to be at that moment, but honestly it was such a blessing to have you guys there. And like, I don't know, we hung out tons, we went golfing.

Mathias 6:05

And honestly, that was a sweet group of dudes to train with, too. Like, it wasn't because of that COVID year. There was a bunch of like pretty high end university guys. Me and JVD, but it was like, yeah, it was a good group and honestly fun, fun dudes. So,

Lucas 6:23

yeah, yeah.

Mathias 6:23

I've heard, I've heard you say before, Berks, that the reason you play and the reason you played so long was national team, whereas a lot of guys play their professional careers alongside national team. And then once they're kind of fading out, they'll just take the summers off from national team and just do the pro thing and kind of cash out, um, for the last couple of years. But I mean, in this story too, you take that, that contract for. Next to no money so that you can have that opportunity again to play for the national team. What's that like for you? What's going, what's kind of the thought process of why that national team summary is way more important than the money or the, or the pro season?

Lucas 7:05

Yeah, like that's exactly right. Yeah. Every decision I make for pro, like always leads back to the national team. Like I remember, I'm having some contracts and I would like message Glenn Hogan like, hey, like, do you think this is like a good place for me to be? Like, what do you think? Like, is this going to like help prepare me? And I mean, I don't know if anyone would really do that with other countries or I don't know. Maybe they do, maybe they don't. But in the back of my mind, I, just wanted to play volleyball to be on the national team. For me, that was like such a big honor to play. And, and the big goal for me was to like make the Olympics. And I was like, okay, whatever I do, like that is, was in my mind, every decision I make. And yeah, there are like some like leagues that you can go to. And like I said, I could have gone to Egypt for like a lot of money. And I remember telling people and they're like, wow, like you got to do this. But in the back of my mind, I was like, Hey, if I do this, maybe that's just kind of, it's going to like wash me out from the national team and you're not going to be as competitive as some of the other guys who are playing in bigger leagues. So I had to turn that away. And like, honestly, even to this day, I don't regret it at all. Like I was really fortunate enough to like go to two Olympics and. Those are the things that really stick out in my career. And, okay, obviously pro is awesome. You meet some sweet dudes, you live in some sweet countries and stuff. But like always for me, I was like, okay, I just want to play national team. I want to like make it as far as I can with that. And that's, yeah, like I said, just kind of how every decision I made just went towards that and it, yeah, it required maybe losing some money, but you know what, money, money will always come and go. But I think those experiences, like, especially something like the Olympics, Very, very few people in the world get to experience that. But like, like I said, I was fortunate, fortunate enough to go to one and like to sacrifice money is like definitely worth it for me.

Mathias 8:57

What are, what are some other things that you've sacrificed to get to the back to back Olympics? Actually, here's, here's another, another part to that is water. We talked to Eric about this and he had an awesome answer. I'm wondering also, what are some things that other people sacrificed to get to For you in your career.

Lucas 9:19

So huge one has got to be Holly. Like Holly, my wife has literally put the last she was overseas with me for nine years. She put her life on hold for nine years, which is a long time to come out of university, like you go to university for five years, come out with a degree, kind of expect it to work out right away. And you have like so much momentum going for you. And she was like part of the basketball team and everything too. So she had like everything going for her. And then all of a sudden, you just kind of stop, like you stop your life, you start stop your progress, almost. And then you go to like a new country. Don't know anyone like I don't know, a lot of people forget about the plus ones or whatever it may be. Um, they just think it's like, wow, you get to travel Europe. You get to like, see all these cool places. It must be amazing. Like you don't have to work, you don't have to do this, but it's definitely a lot harder than people think. Um, Definitely you have some great times and great moments for sure. But there are like a lot of lonely days that you just don't have that community. And for us as players, like when we go to a new team and we get 14, like automatic friends, it's huge. but for like, your loved ones or significant others, they're just kind of stuck at home. Like, I don't know. So it's definitely a lot tougher on them. And like I said, they're just putting their life on hold. They're moving away from their friends and family, and they're not really going to much community. So that's definitely a big one. Like Holly's gotta have, she's definitely made like the biggest sacrifice. definitely to like being gone from loved ones and friends, like that's an obvious one. It's obvious enough where everyone feels it, but and people go about it different ways and it definitely sucks for sure. Another one, I don't know, like I love my life overseas, but maybe another one was not being able to be too comfortable. So I don't know, Oog, maybe you saw this in my, my club history, but I actually never stayed at the same team more than one year. And that's also a reason why I always wanted to Do what's best for national team. Cause I always wanted to like try to take a step forward, forward. And people would ask me this. They're like, why have you never stayed in the same place? And like, that's exactly my reason because yeah, I didn't want to be stagnant. I wanted to always like thrive for a little bit more and like, see what else I can get and get a little bit better, get a little bit better rather than just. Being too comfortable and staying in the same spot and not progressing where someone else may be progressing or whatnot. So maybe that's that like could be a sacrifice, but then again, it's cool to go to new places too. So whatever way you look at it, I guess.

Jesse 11:57

When, when you're choosing contracts. And you want to be ready for the following summer. What are you basing that decision on? Is it who's on the team or is it the quality of the league or, because obviously you said money's not, not really part of the equation. So like, how are you choosing the best quality of.

Lucas 12:19

Yeah, I mean, you do your research on the leagues, um, you see where the team's at and then you also kind of want to know who else is going to be on the team. I mean, it's tough. You can't really go to the coach and be like, Hey, am I going to be a starter? And like a lot of the answers like, well, like whoever earns it and stuff like that, like cliche, but then you kind of see, and you kind of know where your role would be. So definitely you want to be in a good enough league where you're going to improve, but that you're also. Feel like you're going to get a lot of playing time and really progress. But there's two ways of going at it. Cause you could go to a really good team and not play, but you're training every day with the best players in the world. But I don't know. I think a big for me is I wanted to make sure I had game experience because in the summertime. So there's tons of games and that's kind of what you're judged on. So yeah, I was kind of getting a mixture of what's the league like? What's the team like? Is it a decent team? Are they just going to get pummeled? Are you going to be like a key factor within that team? Um, kind of like that.

Mathias 13:24

Do you think you improved every year of your career?

Lucas 13:29

Yeah, I think I did actually. I think, I think I made the biggest step when I went to Deere and actually after, um, an AP. So I give a lot of credit. I don't know. We'll see if Blair's listening to this. I'm sure he will be, but, uh, we worked so hard that year and we were just doing so many cool things. I mean, it was a COVID year too, so you couldn't really do much. And we had keys to the gym. So we're going to the gym every day, whether it be working out or like doing serving reps and, and all this and that, we just went so hard that year. It was like so cool. I'm I think that was the biggest step that I took in my careers that year. And luckily enough, it was right before the Olympics too. But in general, I would say that I've been improving probably every year.

Jesse 14:18

What, what areas. What were you trying to improve that weren't technical?

Lucas 14:24

Well, I did a lot of mental performance stuff. So I worked with Kyle a lot, um, leading into Tokyo especially. And that was a big thing because I did deal with like some confidence stuff and just like really keeping track of. my mistakes and just, I don't know, every time, like when I was young, I would play a game and I would like, have to see my stat sheet. And if I see like a couple errors on it, it didn't matter if I had a great game, I'd always focus on those errors. And like, that was like the biggest thing that really stood out for me. Um, so I had to change that mindset a bit. Um, yeah. And I worked with Kyle a ton that year and it was so good. And I feel like I've learned a ton and then just also being. Being a leader on the court. I mean, I kind of lead with emotions, let's say. So I don't know, I have some pretty funny faces and like images from playing. Um, but I feel like that's the way I play best and just kind of learning how do you play the best? Like what kind of style of play are you, you? So just learning all that. So yeah, I'd say those, those things definitely for sure.

Mathias 15:33

I want to talk about the confidence thing a little bit more because I think that's a huge factor for most athletes that I know besides Kevin Tilley. I saw his podcast, or I listened

Lucas 15:47

to his podcast, it was amazing.

Mathias 15:49

Yeah,

Lucas 15:49

which is super cool. Holly was listening to it with me, and he's like, I was like, he can say whatever he wants, like, you need that. If you're a two time Olympic gold medalist, you need that mentality. Like, everyone needs a bit of that.

Mathias 16:00

Yeah, and it's so cool, and I think that's the gold standard. That's kind of what everyone is trying to get to, is so confident in your skills that you're not thinking about technique, you're not thinking about what happened. If something goes wrong, it's Just a bad day. You just move on to the next one. You do it just as good as you can the next day. But I think that's rare. So what, what were some of the shifts that you made get closer to that? Over your career.

Lucas 16:28

Yeah, it's that's a good point. So one thing that I worked with Kyle on I did like a gratitude journal so every day I would write three things I'm thankful for and Then also before practice I would write three things that I wanted to work on and then you would do a review after that Practice and see how they went. So it's like cool to keep track of Of the goals that you had set in front of you. And then at the end of the day, you just, uh, you did another two things that you were thankful for. So like, you're just, you kind of brought that focus away from volleyball and the mistakes and you change your negative mindset into more of a positive one. And I think that's what I struggled with a lot is I was stuck in that negative mindset. So, like I said, if I had a. a good game, but I still had a couple of errors, like my brain would focus on, Oh man, I can't believe I got blocked. I can't believe I hit that one out. And you could have like hit, I don't know, 700 or whatever. So just like really focusing on what I was grateful for. And that just like helped shift my mindset. And then honestly, like helped on the court too. Because I don't know if you're thinking like that way every day, it's also going to transfer onto the court. Just self talk is a big thing too. Like I would catch myself sometimes being like, I can't believe I hit that out or what did I do? It's just like, okay, no, like shrug it off. just reset, refocus. What's the task at hand? Okay. I hit that ball out. Okay. Why did I hit that out? What was this guy doing? Is he, he's not doing it because he's better than me. He's just like either doing it because maybe he saw something, maybe it was lucky. Okay. See it, adjust, go forward. It's a game. Like they're going to do their tactics. I'm going to do my tactics. It's not because they're better than me. It's just, it's a game. So now let's go forward. It's like, perfect. Let's do this now. So yeah, it's just like really shifting away from dwelling in the past. And that just helps your confidence go more and more.

Mathias 18:26

What about, you mentioned kind of comparison there a little bit. Like that guy's better than me or not better than me. That happens to players on the other side of the net, but also on your side of the net. What have you learned about that or the evolution? How you think about that?

Lucas 18:41

Yeah, it's tough. It was, I mean, it's so cool because that's why volleyball is sweet. It's a team sport, but there's so many one on one battles. Like every position is a one on one battle in a way. So then you could say, I don't know, you're going into a game. You're like, Oh man, I'm playing this middle blocker. Like that's going to be tough. Or this guy's this, like, how am I going to pass him? Or how am I going to stop him? Um, and then it's also weird too, because. especially like on national team and any team you go for there, there is like that internal competition too, but I never wanted to like, be in a position where I'm like wishing doubt or wishing like harm on someone. Like, I don't know. I've caught, I definitely caught, I'm not perfect. I definitely caught myself sometimes being like, Oh man, that guy screwed up. Okay. Like that looks better for me. And then I catch myself. I'm like, why am I thinking this? This is so backwards, right? And this guy's on my team. Like what is going on? Like you're all on the same team and whatever happens, may the best man win. Whoever deserves to play, deserves to play whatever you did your best shot. But like, once you're wishing harm on someone, then you're like, man, Something, there's an issue here. There's a bigger issue at stake.

Jesse 19:54

I just had a thought you played pro for 10 years and the influence of media. And social media and YouTube videos and reels and all that has grown exponentially in the last, let's say, six years. Crazy, yeah. Has that changed how you view opposing middle blockers? Like, in the beginning of your career, you didn't really know anyone. But now, let's say you're going VNL and you're going to play Cuba. And all these reels of Simone just bouncing 30s are running through your head. How has that changed your approach to playing some of these superstars? Whereas before it was purely based on statistics and data and video analysis. But now, you're also dealing with, like, social hype. Totally.

Lucas 20:45

Yeah, man, like, a good one, a good example is Kofi. Like, you see? Is and he's an amazing player, but you see his instagrams and you're like this guy's gonna jump over top of me Like this is insane. And that's just like yeah, there's so many players like that and they're all good players But I don't know. I don't think I let it affect me too too much maybe because When I got older I kind of knew them already and then I don't know but it's definitely it's definitely intimidating

Jesse 21:16

well, how would you You I guess now, now you're, you're moving into more of a sport director coaching role in Edmonton, would you say to young athletes that are always looking at the screen being like, Whoa, do you see how high that guy jumps? Or, cause I know I experienced that. I'm like, there's no way I can do that. to someone who doesn't have access to the whole game video, how do you, what would you say to one of your youth players now that's like, well, I'm never going to reach that level. I'm never going to be able to hit that hard or jump that high.

Lucas 21:43

Yeah. I mean, yeah. And also a good example of that is like watching hitting warmup and you see people balancing hitting warmups and they go to game and that will never happen. And it's just like, it's funny because a hitting warmup can be a game. Bring a lot of intimidation. Like I know I've been victim of that. If I see guys bouncing balls in the hitting room, I'm like, man, this is going to be a tough game and maybe that's all they can do. I don't know. But like, it's, it's definitely the initial third, like, Oh man, these guys are good. Like they're all of a sudden like amazing a volleyball because they can bounce a ball. So I don't know. I would just say like, there's so much to volleyball then. Being able to bounce a ball with no man block, like, you could tell your athletes, but okay, look where they're actually contacting the ball. Like at the net, it's like sometimes they're hitting this far above this high above the net, but they're going straight down. at the end of the day, we're all stepping on the court. changes. Um, it's not like definitely there's highlights in a game, but whatever, one point to one point, and then we're going to go on. And then let's see, who knows, maybe they can't pass a ball. You know what? I'm going to go back there. I'm going to serve this guy float because I know he struggles on float, but he might bounce a ball. But you know what? One point on an ACE is the same as a bounce on a three meter line or whatever. I just, you definitely can't believe all the hype and it's, but it's cool. Like it's sweet that people are putting this content out because. It's also growing the game. It's people are seeing volleyball now. And like, I've seen tons of house of highlights and like a volleyball game. And people are like, wow, this is like the craziest game of pick up balloon or whatever, keep the balloon in the air, but whatever it's getting volleyball on their feeds now. So. You know, I have nothing against these like highlight reels that people are posting. So we do it, do what you want. It's growing the game. It doesn't matter to me, but definitely as an opposing player, don't get too caught up on it and don't think that they're all of a sudden way better than you because they have a 50 inch vertical or whatever. Like let's play. Let's see where we're at and go from there. Good answer. Good answer.

Mathias 23:44

Yeah. I got one last question on general career stuff. Berks. You played 10 years professionally, 14 years with the national team. Do you have any regrets? Ooh, any

Lucas 24:04

regrets? This is a kind of, this is kind of a funny out of volleyball one. I regret not learning a language because everyone's like, Oh, so did you pick up these language? Did you, like you lived in France? Like that must've been easy. I'm like, Uh, actually, no, I never really picked up. I took Italian lessons one time with a teammate, actually a teammate and his girlfriend. We would like host them for coffee at our place. They'd come over and teach us Italian lessons. Like we had the sticky tabs on every like object in our kitchen, just trying to learn with the Italian words on it and just trying to learn, but it just never really sticked. I mean, it was cool learning a little bit, but. I think that was, that's kind of like an out of volleyball regret. In volleyball, I don't think I do. I think like I'm happy with how it all went. Definitely like you could wish for better results and stuff, but the journey on it, I don't know. Everything happened for a reason. There was a plan set out and follow through, but let's maybe just stick with the, with the language one. Yeah. That is kind of embarrassing. Yeah.

Jesse 25:16

I actually have one more question about this too is I have a theory that the people who play the longest have the most fun and Kevin when we had him on touched about that is how having fun is the most important and and you obviously love to have fun you love having emotion you love to smile😊you love to joke🤪around play pranks in the hotel🏨and stuff like that oh

Lucas 25:39

I do not🙅🏼‍♂️like playing pranks I only did it as retaliation😡I did not like doing pranks Well. But I had to end it.🛑

Jesse 25:49

We'll leave that up to debate. Um, but you love playing card games. You love like hanging out with the team. Am I speculating or do you believe that that actually has a huge, that's a huge key to success is fun and playing and playing for a living. A

Lucas 26:05

hundred percent. Like if you're not enjoying what you're doing and not playing, then I don't know. I'm sure you guys have, uh, Examples of this to you, like how many times do you go to morning☀️weights🏋🏼and people are rolling in and be like, Oh man, like, I'm so tired😴I don't feel🙄like lifting right now. Why are we lifting so early? Or what? We have to, oh, we have to go to court🏐now after we lift💪🏻And you're just like, man🤦🏼we play volleyball for a living😍I'm Playing with my best buddies🤝right now, like when you change your mindset into joy🥳like it's crazy🤯how much better📈you become, the motivation, your workouts are going to be a hundred times better because you're actually enjoying what you're doing, not just trying to get it done and you're Go back to bed after like everything becomes so much better. You end up vibing with your teammates. So you're building like team culture. You're getting better working and you're just enjoying life. Like, I don't know. It's just like such a domino effect of what that can bring. And that's huge. And like, at the end of the day, we're playing like we're playing volleyball for a living. It's The best job in the world. Like, how can you ever complain about that? So things like that, it's like, I never want to complain, especially with my job. Um, and then just, yeah, when you're having fun with your teammates and on court, off court, like such a big thing. I remember Kevin or I heard Kevin say that, like, and it's evident seeing the French team, they all hang out together off the court and stuff. And yeah, we do that too. But like, you can see when teams are doing that and it's like so cool just because you build that brotherhood and. It transferred onto the court to when, okay, like, I know this guy's going to have my back. We're not just co workers. Like, I know this guy really cares for me. We're going to go to battle. Okay, sick. Let's do this together. And it's just like all meshes together. And it's so, so important to have that joy. So I know you guys all, you guys all play with that too. So I'm sure you guys can, can speak on that, but it's crazy important.

Mathias 28:03

Um, coming off of your second Olympic games, What's one thing you would tell yourself going into your first Olympic Games?

Lucas 28:09

Be present in the moment.

Mathias 28:12

Can you expand?

Lucas 28:15

Um, yeah, well, there's so much going on. So just especially so many things you want to see. So many things you want to do. People trying to talk with you and all that. But the biggest thing is to always just be present. Um, you'll talk to these other people later, they'll still be there, but there's only one Olympic games that are for sure, if you're there, so just be present, take it all in and, um, stay focused at the goal in hand.

Jesse 28:46

I actually, I actually have a question about that. Before we get into blocking, I asked Brett this question, but we weren't recording at the time and I wish we were. Um, I read this study. Where a lot of athletes to go to the Olympics, you're at the peak pinnacle of your sport, you're walking around and you're seeing LeBron and you're at this Mecca of athletics and then all of a sudden it's over and a lot of athletes, um, experienced a lot of depression and they didn't really understand why. And it's because you're at the. Highest point of your career and then all of a sudden it's over and you're back home. You're sitting on your couch You have no idea what to do. Did you experience anything talk about me right now?

Lucas 29:37

Yeah, so did you experience anything like

Jesse 29:39

that

Lucas 29:39

totally definitely, um, yeah, it's like the it's a super common thing like post olympic depression um, because yeah, like you said you're training for so long for that one moment and then all of a sudden it's Done and it's over with and then it's like, okay, you either restart or you're just done with that So yeah, I would say after um after tokyo for sure and like I felt pretty fortunate enough because I was still playing Um, so you still at least go to a new club and need kind of new task at hand, but definitely experience that as well um, but even right now like You can, like, talk to Holly, like, there's definitely been some, like, down days where I'm just like, man, what am I doing right now, like, all of this, like, cannot even just the Olympics, but, like, playing for the past 15 or 10 years, 15 years with, like, national team stuff. And now it's all done, and now you've, like, really, like, think on. Okay, what's the next chapter in my life look like and you have to set everything up and everything's brand new and you're moving and you're just like whoa you went from this crazy high to now like it's all like a mess right now so definitely like some harder times and there's been good times too definitely but um yeah it's just like a big adjustment it's it's pretty crazy to experience all of that so uh yeah it's definitely a thing but for the most part i'm doing okay so don't worry yeah

Jesse 30:58

thanks well no thanks for saying that because i think a lot of people will Don't know that or don't understand that. Yeah. It's just like, well, you went to Libya. It's so cool. And you're playing, but there's a lot of, uh, baggage that comes with that, I guess.

Lucas 31:13

Totally. And that's like this whole lifestyle that we do too. Like everyone sees us overseas and playing volleyball. I think it's the best life ever, but there is a lot of baggage and yeah, definitely with the Olympics too. Like it's such a worldwide event that everyone's watching and you're just like put on such a high pedestal and like you, something that you worked for your whole career and your whole life. And now it's all of a sudden done. And BOOM you're just like, kind of someone pops the ball, the bubble on you. And you're just like, okay. Yeah. Now, where'd I go in life here? So it's, it's pretty interesting. Did

Mathias 31:48

you know, did you know going into the Olympics, it was going to be kind of your last. Yeah. Hurrah.

Lucas 31:56

Yeah, I did. Yeah. It was always, well, this is kind of funny. So there's, there's even talks that I would be done playing after Tokyo Olympics. And um, yeah, we would just kind of get on with life and I would try to do like get into firefighting and stuff like that. And then after the Tokyo Olympics, I was like, I am not done. Like I never really told anyone, maybe a couple people kind of knew that maybe that would be an option. But I didn't really want to tell anyone because I Just never felt comfortable with letting people know that I was thinking about stopping after the Olympics and then yeah, once I finished I was like, there's no way that I feel like I'm okay with being done right now like I feel like I can give so much more to the sport and all that and like really push for another quad and like luckily at that time since Um, played a part in the last Olympics, it pushed it, um, a year forward. So then it was only three more years until Paris. And so then, yeah, Holly and I, we like agreed, okay, let's do this last cycle. Let's finish it off. And then after that we'll be done. And honestly, like I was ready to be done after this. Um, definitely still miss playing and stuff, but I think it all in all is like the best time for the family and I, but yeah, there's like, I'm not going to lie. Definitely miss playing. especially seeing, well, I guess Jesse's playing overseas right now, but seeing you guys train and stuff, I'm like, man, that's, that was the life. Like, it's so, so cool, but I don't know, make choices. And I'm still happy with what we're doing, but I mean, it's sweet that you missed it because That means you really loved what you did. And that last 10 years was like, definitely worth it.

Mathias 33:37

It's a good perspective. Cool. Yeah. Yeah. I love hearing that too. Cause when you're in it, like sometimes it sucks, even though we talk about bringing that joy and it is the best job in the world and you're absolutely right. But. It's not sunshine and rainbows every day. And so I think having that perspective that one day it will be over and you don't know when, I think you were lucky that you, you had an amazing career. You got to decide this is the time. This is when I move on and it's still hard and there's career injury injuries. There's so much stuff that can happen. So it's cool perspective to try to maintain that. While you're in the heat of battle, um, in a season when things maybe aren't going well, it's just the gratitude that going back to that, like, there's so much to be grateful for and just being present and soaking it all in.

Lucas 34:27

How was that for you, Thias Like having to stop mainly because of injury.

Mathias 34:32

Yeah, um, it's really tough because I feel like there was so much left on the table for me and I had like massive goals that I felt like I was on track to achieve or at least was really enjoying the pursuit of them. So yeah, it feels like a lot of unfinished business. But then on the other hand, I'm insanely grateful for what I was able to accomplish and the people I met, the experiences I had, um, just being able to dedicate myself to something a hundred percent every day, I think it's cool. And what I'm learning is that you can, you can do that in other areas as well. And I think that's the part that I loved above all. It was like the pursuit of excellence with with a team. And so, there's There's plenty to be grateful for again, outside of the sport. And I'm trying to really focus on that. Like you're saying the positive and figuring out how I can find some joy in, in what's next instead of just, I feel like there's literally zero benefit to ruminating on what happened. And the past and regrets and all that stuff. It does nothing for you. So I'm really trying to just keep my, my vision forward and positive. And

Lucas 36:06

yeah. Yeah. That's a really good perspective. Because yeah, well you like took so many, you did so many sacrifices to like, like, okay, I'm going to leave school early because this is what I want to do. Like, you're like fully in it. And then like, for it to end just so abruptly and like such an unfortunate. Circumstance to happen like that's definitely gonna suck, but so cool that you're at least back in a team atmosphere You're back with trinity and like you're still involved just like in a different I don't know I guess role but like you're still like fully in it, which is which is huge And it's really cool to see but that's a good perspective is like you could be All mopey and whatever about it, but like really how far is that going to get you?

Mathias 36:49

Another thing, another thing that I've been thinking of kind of along those lines is like impact versus accolades because a lot of what I was doing was somewhat for the accolades. I really wanted to be an Olympian just so that I could say I was an Olympian and I really wanted to win pro leagues just to say that I'd won pro leagues. And at the end of the day that it's only me and my memories that that kind of affects, whereas now on the coaching side, in, in like five months, I've had a bigger impact on some of the kids that I'm coaching now than I would have had in my entire volleyball career, no matter how many medals I won, or how high I was able to rise. I think That's the cool part. Now being on this side of it is actually how much you can influence other people and be a positive role model for them in a coaching position.

Lucas 37:48

Yeah, that's so cool. That's what I love about coaching too. It's such like a selfless position on a team. Like it's so cool. I think you're, you're great for that. That's, that's a really good perspective.

Jesse 37:58

Well, that's a really beautiful transition into blocking and coaching. You've, you've taken up a more of a coaching role as direct sport director role and blocking is an incredibly difficult skill. I think without a doubt, the hardest skill in volleyball, perform and execute perfectly. Well, you're never going to perform and execute perfectly every time, but that's the goal. How, what are the key principles to blocking that you're teaching? Your kids and that you've learned along the way.

Lucas 38:30

yeah, I think it's so important to first be able to read the game. Like, okay, first, for me, like, I was never a big commit blocker. I always loved reading, doing, yeah, read blocks. I think that's so important because you really understand the game more that way. You understand what the other team's doing. Um, you understand their set a little bit better. You understand just kind of like way more than just, okay, I'm going to commit. It's a good pass. I'm just going to commit. And then, I'll see if I can react and get second touch if we dig it somehow or whatever. So that's a big thing. Um, some things that I also teach, just like I'm teaching a lot of young, young kids right now too. So just like proper footwork, a lot of them don't understand. Um, a big thing for me is like, Okay. How does my second step look like my big crossover step? That's like a really big thing that I've always had to work on and make sure it's big enough so that I'm closing the block and, and, uh, just getting to the right spot. Um, but there's, it's creative blockings. There's so many different techniques to it now. Like so many people trying to evolutionize it or just revamp it and do whatever it be like split read or whatnot, or just reading and, or just like normal. crossover, swing block, whatever it may be. But at the end of the day, if you can get there, you can get there. Like just get there as fast as you can. But everyone, I think everyone's going to be different too. I tried the split step and it wasn't as effective for me. Maybe I was too far gone. Um, but then there are certain footworks that work for me. So I don't think there's a wrong way to do it. I mean, at the end of the day, if you can get there and get solid block, perfect. Let's do that. But, uh, yeah, I don't know. I guess there's so much to it, but, uh, those are some big things.

Jesse 40:28

No, that's cool. Cause that's very similar answer to Kevin and reception. He's like, it's not picture perfect, but the ball gets from A to B, right? If you're getting from the center of the court to the side of the court and you're touching the ball, you've done your job.

Lucas 40:41

Yeah, exactly.

Jesse 40:42

That's really cool. I want to talk about this commit block thing for a little bit, because At least when we were at university, we had the belief that the other team wouldn't be able to run the middle enough to win the game. So we almost never commit block. But I think at the next level, the passing is so good and a setter middle connection is so good that there is. a benefit to occasionally commit blocking? For sure. How do you decide when to commit? And what are you thinking about when you're committing?

Lucas 41:20

Yeah, there's for sure, there's definitely times to commit. I think In all levels you can commit here and there. Um, what I'm thinking when I'm committing a big thing that I'm looking at is, okay, who's in the front row with me? Do I have a smaller setter with me or do I have a big opposite? So if I have a smaller setter with me, there's a good chance that the setter is going to set their left side to attack that setter. So do I want to leave him one on one when there's really already a mismatch? Or maybe I have a big opposite, like say Arthur's blocking with me. And there's a good chance that maybe that setter is not going to set that way. So, okay. Maybe I could take a little bit more of a risk on my guy and I can commit here. So that those are definitely like things that I'm considering when I'm commit blocking. Um, there's other things like. There's game plans. Sometimes when the setter is in P6 or P3, like some reason, that's a, a really high, um, chance that the setter is going to run the middle. So a lot of setters like running in that, but it's just game plan and scouting. So you can see, um, yeah, sometimes they run the middle 65, 70 percent here. Let's have an option. Let's commit. So just knowing the game plan, knowing your opponent coming into the game definitely helps. Um, or also just like the timing of the game. Maybe. It's at the end of the set. And there's one guy that they love giving to the ball when it's a close post game and close set. So it could be a middle, maybe they like running in the middle at the end. He's like their best player. Let's give them the ball. It's like, okay, I'm going to commit here. Or maybe they set their, they have a stud opposite and it's near the end of the set. Okay. I'm probably not going to commit right now because they're probably going to set this opposite who they want to like rely on, especially at the end of the game. So kind of the different factors like that. When I'm going to command, why not?

Mathias 43:20

Is there like a, almost like a weight to each player? Like a left side, right side, middle and pipe?

Lucas 43:30

Do you feel

Mathias 43:30

pressure differently from different levels of attackers? And then you adjust your position or maybe your read based on that?

Lucas 43:41

Definitely, like, I think it changes. I mean, on every team, it depends on who their stud player is. So, like, sometimes with the Nashville team, if they have, like, a stud, right side, or they're, like, setting right side in this one position, we're gonna, like, take, like, a step left, and that's gonna be our initial, like, starting spot. So we take a step left after we serve, we get set, but we're already kind of cheating towards their opposite, um, getting ready to block. So it really, it really depends who you play. I don't think there's like a right or wrong answer. Um, yeah, I would just say it depends who you play on

Mathias 44:17

keeping on with this, like reading kind of trend. Um, what is your, as a middle, like what's the first thing you pick up on after the ball is passed? Like what's your kind of sequence to reading?

Lucas 44:32

Yeah, yeah, definitely. So you look at their passer and you see where the ball is going. If you, you kind of seen the ball, is there like middle still available? And then as the ball is being passed, you can kind of like still see their middle in your peripheral. So, you know, if he's coming like a hard 50, or maybe he's going like a 31. So you kind of see, and then once you see where he is, as soon as the ball that keeps going to the setter, then your eyes are focused on the setter. And then once they're on the setter, then you react. So you should know, or I, yeah, you should know where the middle is before the setter contacts the ball. So you could react to wherever the set goes. So if he does set middle and it's a 31, you already know he's in that 31 gap. So, um, yeah, that's kind of the sequence for my eyes.

Mathias 45:24

And when you're reading setters. Are you looking at body position or you just watching the ball and reacting to where that goes? Are you reading hands? What are you paying attention to?

Lucas 45:38

Yeah, definitely looking kind of at the upper part. So like their hands and the ball. So like sometimes with setters, they really rotate their hands back when they set. So like once their hands are back, you're like, okay, it's going to their opposites going back. So that's a big cue or sometimes. Setters like to like really extend when they're setting the middle. So they're like kind of pushing their hands forward. And so they're going to do like some cues and you could see like, okay, if his hands are like a little bit farther ahead, he's not going to step back. There's a good chance he's setting the middle here. Obviously the better setter you are, like you're hiding all those little cues. So it becomes a lot more difficult, but, uh, yeah, you're kind of watching their hands on the ball area, more of their hands. Yeah.

Mathias 46:22

If you had to break down like a time spent on each piece of the read. Would you say that your eyes are on the setter for the longest?

Lucas 46:32

Yeah,

Mathias 46:34

I would

Lucas 46:34

say yeah for sure on the setter the longest so yeah, you're just you're not really looking at the middle you're just kind of like you see him in your peripheral you see kind of where he goes but you're waiting for like the pass to see where the pass is going and then that will come into where the setter is too right so yeah it's definitely like that area is the longest.

Jesse 46:55

Cool. We mentioned earlier in the podcast about the evolution of the game. Near the end of your career, did you ever experience or experiment with, uh, pulling your hands or dropping your hands in high ball?

Lucas 47:11

Yeah, I definitely did. Yeah. Uh, it's pulling is such a funny concept. I will say I'm pro for pulling. Um, I love playing those games with the outside hitters and just, you know, It's I think we need to do a better job if you're doing it on your team and your middle blockers doing it Just embrace it because if you do it and you score the guy fooms it out. That is a classic middle response If I mess up, just embrace it. How many times are you gonna pull your hands and the guy fooms it out and everyone's like Oh, that is so smart. You're like, I can't believe you did that. You're a genius, blah, blah, blah. But the minute you pull your hands and they score, everyone's like,

Mathias 48:00

what,

Lucas 48:00

like, what are you doing? Yeah, you got to play both cards here. Like that I've been so many times, but I think there's definitely time and place to do it. There's like so many times. Well, actually, have you guys seen the Japanese lately? They pull but with their fingers. So they like do fist blocks almost. You got to see it. I think Ishikawa does it. There's, you guys got to do some research and do some pulls with the finger pulls. So it's, so I think that's brilliant because you're still there for the block, but you're not, you're not giving them your fingertips where like, obviously all those like high off hands are going. That's actually,

Mathias 48:42

I never thought about that, but that's actually a crazy, cause the majority of the balls that I get scored on or skipped are, yeah. This like you just close your fist,

Lucas 48:54

just close your fist. It's not there, but you still have a block up.

Mathias 48:57

Yeah, yeah. That's cool. Cause then you can still get them if they bring it down.

Lucas 49:00

Yeah. Yeah.

Jesse 49:01

even if you if they pull and you still score It still gives you an extra thing to think about you're like, oh boy. Yeah. Yeah. I remember that happened My first summer training with the A team, my first swing of the summer, Jay pulled, Jay Blankenow pulled on me and I hit the wall and I was like, and the rest of the summer, there was just that, an extra second of thought like, okay, what am I going to do? Yeah, yeah, I think it, I think there is definitely some benefit to it, depending on the spiker and the situation for sure. Like, you're not going to just pull for the sake of pulling.

Lucas 49:36

Yeah. Yeah. So say you pull and they still score, maybe they're still going to be like, Oh, okay. Maybe they'll pull again. Maybe I'm not going to hit as high and they don't pull and then you end up getting a block. So you're just like thinking it's just a little mind game and then like, okay, it's a little. One on one mind game here. What are you going to do next? Am I going to pull? Am I not? But now that's in the repertoire. So something extra to think about.

Jesse 49:58

It is cool. Like even, even like a hybrid serve, like you have, you have two things to think about spin and the float, you know, like it just, you, you gain an advantage, even if it's a second, a one second advantage, you know?

Lucas 50:10

Yeah, totally. And maybe you don't pull and they still score. Okay. But if I pull and they score still. But now I'm also adding that other perspective or other aspect to it. So it could be worth it. I

Jesse 50:23

don't know. Cause the reality is the spiker has the advantage 99 percent of the time, right? So you're just trying to gain little advantages where you can. And I think that's a great way to do it. I think you're, you're bang on with that answer.

Mathias 50:36

Yeah. What are some of the mind games that go on in a middle of the middle battle when you are in a big matchup and you guys are committing on each other and are you thinking about those sorts of things also?

Lucas 50:51

Yeah, yeah, totally. I mean, okay, the best feeling👏🏼as a middle blocker is having that middle blocker commit on you and you still score on that. You're just like, okay, like, that is like the biggest call. I'd probably be the biggest. I'd rather that than a big block, maybe, probably. I don't know. It's just like cool that, okay, I know you're committing on me. So first you're giving me that respect🙏🏼to commit a block. And maybe that's also why I don't like commit blocking a lot. I'm like, I don't want to give you that respect, that like, you're so good🦾that I need to commit on you. Like, I'd rather like, oh, if I like, I'm just reading and I could still slow you down or still get a block on you,💥BOOM💥like, I can still do that when I'm reading👀But if I'm committing, full like pits, and then he sets right side or left side, and I'm just like, ooh, that's like a mind battle right there too, because you're giving that guy that respect. And then you're giving up a one on one. So there's like little things like that. And we've had some good battles, like even this past summer, Danny, Demi, Niko, and I had some good battles in practice. And there's been like a couple, like times where we both commit and then the guy who's attacking will either not get set. And you're just like yelling, Oh, one on one, like you're just letting everyone know, but you're just saying it. So that, that middle, like here, obviously he hears it. But it's in your head, like, Oh man, if I'm committing and someone's yelling one, I'm just like, Oh man, that's like extra, like shot in the foot kind of thing. And then with the setter too, there's tons of mind games with the setter because the setter's goal is to get one on ones and try to get, like, spread the offense. I remember playing Fernando in Monza and he's the kind of setter, and not every setter does this, but where they look across the net and you kind of, like, You have that eye contact with them. I think that like split a second before they're setting, you're just like staring at each other. And then they like, we'll set something. And so it's just like, it's like, it's like so much more personal now because you have that eye contact mid rally and then it becomes like a mind game in itself right there too. So it's, it's kind of funny. I mean, not every setter does that. Even the top setters, some don't do that, but some do. And I'm like, Oh, that's like a mind game because now we've made this personal.

Mathias 53:01

Do you ever do any show and take kind of things where. You shift so that they're looking at you and then you come back or something like that? No, I think that's useless. I don't, I don't like that. That's too much

Jesse 53:12

movement

Mathias 53:12

for Big Berks.

Jesse 53:15

He needs to save his energy.

Lucas 53:17

I think, well, I think, I don't think hey Thias you set does that really juke you out? I feel like it's so obvious that like, you're like overemphasizing like a step and then you're going back and back the other way. I don't know. I feel like that doesn't actually get the centers the way you think it might.

Mathias 53:36

Yeah, definitely like a fake step. Nothing's gonna happen, but I think if you set up fronting the 30 for example Yeah, and then you just release to the right side from that position Yeah, I don't know if you'd be able to catch that as a setter if you do it after they put their eyes back on The ball.

Lucas 53:58

Right, right. That's true. Yeah, I've I can't say I've like done that too too much Especially like now with the last few years of national team, you're kind of set up before the play happens. So I don't know, Thomas, it was never really like, okay, like do a fake in the goal. He's like, okay, you just get to your spot, everyone's set. And then we react from there. And that's kind of how I've also played. my whole career similar like that.

Mathias 54:24

Well, that's actually a good point because blocking is absolutely a team skill, even though the middle blockers kind of the commander, you're in charge of most of what goes on in the block inside of things. You need those outside players to be doing what they're doing and I guess setting up neutral and taking a bit of everything is commonly known as the best way to do it. Yeah. What makes a really good outside blocker? Who are your favorite outside blockers to play with? And what are some of their characteristics?

Lucas 54:55

Yeah, uh, so I would say one of my favorite outside blockers to play with, I'll never admit to his face. No, I would, uh, is, uh, Steve Marr. He is such a good help blocker, especially in the middle. There's so many, like, he's always there. And I think that's, that's, that's, The beauty with how the game has gone is the blockers are more compact like their starting position everyone Like you're expected as an outside blocker to be able to help in the middle if they're in your zone or help on the pipe And that makes attacking as a middle blocker so much more difficult. Like I hate when there's help block Um, but yeah, steve marr does a really good job at that. So I know if they're if their middle is running like a 51 Okay, I better not be jumping to my left because I know steve's there. So I'm going to like make sure I'm either blocking straight to six or taking that one angle because he's always there and there's so many times As a middle blocker like you see their middle coming hard to the center and he's kind of to your left So your natural reaction is to like jump towards the ball. Yeah, steve is there And so I'm like, okay, well, like, there's no point of helping because we're both in the same spot right now. And I'm like, okay, I gotta remember that. And there's been so many times, like, okay, that's my bad. I have to take more to one, like, I know you're there, so. For the most part, he is always there. And so it just gives me a lot more freedom to, I don't know, make, a bigger option in the middle and take like more direction because I know Steve will be there or That I can just like release more to their left side So to my right because I know Steve will help me in the middle and gives me more freedom to Not worry so much about their middle, but I can also react to their left sides

Jesse 56:43

I heard uh that gram vibe grass was like the ultimate quarterback Oh, yeah defense and he was telling Everyone, exactly where to go, everyone, exactly what was going to happen. Yeah. I know you didn't, you were never in the front row with him because you're both middles, but as a younger middle of the national team program, can you speak to some things that he taught you as you were coming up before he retired and stuff like that? Cause I heard it was as an outside blocker, it was so peaceful. Cause he, he gave you every bit of information.

Lucas 57:16

Yeah, like Graham is like one of the smartest volleyball players. I know probably one of the smartest guys actually in general, but he just understands the game so well and he's so confident with what he does. I think that's the biggest thing is, okay, this is our plan and we're going to execute it. I don't want you to like say, oh, maybe like you should help in the middle because I'm going here. He's like, no, okay, you're going to help in the middle. I'm going to release to position four. This is what we're doing. Let's go. And it's like, he has a reason. for it too. And if it doesn't work, okay, then we adjust. And like, obviously, volleyball is a game that changes all the time and they're going to change your tactics too. They're not going to play the exact same way that you game plan, but he has such a strong base of knowledge that, um, yeah, like he understands the game and he's just confident with it. So. That's something I've learned and just the way he plays, he's not necessarily like the loudest like raw raw guy You know, you can always count on him. It's it's funny. There is one question that we had that Antigua asked us and he says if there's one guy you could go to battle with on this team who would it be and Honestly Graham was probably the majority of the answers because he's just that kind of guy that kind of leader that Okay, you know what I know this guy's gonna have my back no matter what he just understands what's going on And he is gonna just yeah be on your side. He's gonna execute this game plan He knows I trust him like I will follow his lead. So I definitely learned a lot from him And uh, it's so cool that he's now coach at ufc I think it's like gonna be so good for the program and so good for volleyball canada, too So, yeah, it's cool that he's still involved in giving his knowledge and A lot of, a lot of young guys are going to learn from him.

Jesse 59:10

So we talked about your eyes on the set or what you're picking up. You And we've talked a lot about the evolution of volleyball and now middles are running a lot of like pops and pulls and pushes and all kinds of movement. How do you pick that up and what are you looking for when the middle is approaching and you're not, especially like when you play the Argentinians, you know, they're jumping in front of the center but hitting a 60 and like all these things, like, it's got to be tough on your eyes, no?

Lucas 59:36

Yeah, it's definitely tough. Um, yeah, especially playing like a middle like moves there Like he's so good at the pops and pushes and a lot of the american guys are doing that too Um, but I also think that's also huge why you have health blockers, too So just to make sure that they also understand that so if they are drifting into their zone, they're still there. They're still helping Um, so like as long as everyone is on the same page and we know You Their routes, luckily, like with game plan and scouting and stuff, you can see kind of the routes that they like to run the most. So if everyone's aware beforehand, like, okay, this guy, especially in this rotation, he likes to run like a little slider push. Okay. So make sure you still stay for the help and you're not like fully releasing on your guy. So just really knowing how these players are and what kind of shots and sets they like to hit from is huge. And then just, yeah, like I said, As the middle blocker, you're, you're the quarterback. So before every rally, we're telling guys what we're doing and then we're telling them what they're doing too. So that's a really cool thing. Um, that everyone's just on the same page. And once one person kind of blows their assignment, that just breaks down the whole, your whole defense. So that's why blocking so cool, because that's just. The initial of your defense, and if there's a hole in the block, boom, like, there's a good chance there's, like, hopefully someone could save, save it in the back row or do, like, a special dig, but once one thing breaks down, like, there's a good chance the rest of your defense is going to crumble from that.

Mathias 1:01:10

Gotta be so frustrating as a middle when your outside blocker's supposed to be there and they're just gone. Yeah, it looks so bad on you. It looks like you just blew your assignment, but really your outside guy just ditched you.

Lucas 1:01:24

Yeah, exactly. Totally. Yeah. That's, uh, yeah. Cause the middle could bounce like a 30 and you're not following at all because you're expecting your setter opposite to be there and then they leave and then boom, just like bounces on you and you're just like, well, everyone sees that as your guy. You're the guy that you're supposed to block. Just bounce on you. That's your bad. And you're like, ah, okay. Well, that's. That wasn't supposed to go like that because we had a system, but then again, the same thing happens to middle blockers. Like, I could, like I said before, I have a plan that I know my outside blocker is going to help me in the middle. And yet I still jump towards five, even though I know he's there just cause it's like a natural reaction. And it's same with them. Like you see your guy approaching hard at you, you think it's still going to go. To your left side, let's say, and you fully release, but you just read it wrong. But that's, I guess what makes the great teams for just being a good team is everyone's on the same page and you have that system and you just execute it more precisely.

Mathias 1:02:25

Goes back to that confidence and commitment. Even if you get it wrong, if everyone commits to what you wanted to do before the play, then you can actually reevaluate and try it again. If people are just doing whatever they want every time, then there's no baseline to make changes for. Or any kind of adjustment.

Lucas 1:02:45

Yeah, a hundred percent.

Mathias 1:02:49

Cool. One last question. All encompassing. If you could give yourself some advice, let's say as someone going into university, could you go back to Lucas, coming out of high school, going into university, what would you tell yourself about volleyball and about life as an athlete?

Lucas 1:03:12

One thing I wish, I wish I got into international volleyball a lot earlier than I did. I wish I was watching these pro matches because I don't think I really started watching pro until maybe I was in pro. I don't even know if I watched many in university, like maybe a couple of champions league here and there, but I wasn't really invested into international volleyball. And so it just like kind of having like a late start on that. So I wish I started that aspect. Earlier, because then you just learn the game so much quicker and you know what the top players are doing, you know what you need to get better at, you know, so much more. So that could be one advice when I was younger going into university. What was the other question?

Mathias 1:04:02

Well, volleyball or life as an athlete. Oh, life as an athlete.

Lucas 1:04:08

I don't know. Connect with people. Keep connected. I did pretty good at this. Yeah. I would say that a big thing is branch out. Don't stay. I did this in my first year of, uh, I was in Sweden my first year, first half of the year. I did. Like. Do much with the team and I really had a hard time. So Yeah, once I started connecting with the guys like life became so much easier It's so cool. Just hearing their story and you really have this bond by playing volleyball So like you can connect on that and then just like yeah hearing their different culture learning their culture their lifestyle It's so cool. It's such a cool opportunity that we have living overseas still so I would say You Dive into that, fully embrace it, get to know people. It's such a cool, unique experience that a lot of people probably don't understand until you're in it. So really embrace that

Mathias 1:05:08

and learn the language.

Lucas 1:05:09

And learn the language. Yeah. So I don't have that biggest regret of my career.

Jesse 1:05:16

Can you say, uh, signing off in Italian? Oh, that even dead chick. That's all I got. That's awesome.

Mathias 1:05:32

All right. I think that wraps up, uh, episode number 20 of the pitch pro podcast. Thanks Lucas for coming on. Thanks everyone for listening. Signing off.

1:05:45

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